Questions regarding retaining control over a story.

“Learn the rules like a pro, so you can break them like an artist.” - Pablo Picasso

This thread posits several questions about the relationship between story owners and contributors, it's my hope that I can get an official response from a mod or admin, but any response is welcome as far as I'm concerned. Extra information about how the relationship between Owners, Editors, and Authors in general is very welcome. Additionally, if allowed, I would like to broaden the topic of this thread to include discussion of my story, which is linked below, and more casual discussion as part of my introduction to the community.

The broader question or TLDR of the questions I'll be asking here boils down to this - where does power over a moderated story lie? Does the owner generally maintain control, or by letting people access my story, do I surrender some control over it? Additionally, how much power do moderators and admins have over my story, can my story be "stolen" from me by a mod or admin?

Questions

1) If I approve a contribution to a moderated story I'm the owner of, can I change my mind later and delete it? Or would I be stuck with said contribution? The answer to this question would strongly affect how much scrutiny chapters undergo before I approve. Although obviously, I would tend to make sure any chapter I approve fits with the story anyway, the prospect of losing a degree of control over my story would force a certain rigidity.

2) Can I edit contributions to a moderate story I'm the owner of? This question has similar, but lesser implications than the previous one, it would suck if I can't edit typos I missed from contributors, I personally would never make content edits a contributor hadn't already agree to.

3) If I'm inactive, to what extent can control over my story be transferred to someone else? Can I permanently lose control over the story?

4) Can my control over a story I'm the owner of be transferred for any reasons not stated in the guide? I'll say it outright, maintaining control over my story is important to me, I don't want to lose it if I don't have to.

5) From a legal standpoint, who has control over the intellectual rights of content written on this site? Can the site administrators and mods technically kick me out of my own story on a whim and sell it? Currently I've only begun a fan fiction project, but the answer to this question might decide whether or not I embark on different kinds of stories in the future.

6) Even if I legally have no ownership, from a policy standpoint, how much control am I allowed over the content I write on here? Can the site administrators and mods practically kick me out of my own story on a whim and sell it? It's important for me to note, I am by no means criticizing the moderators or administrators on here, indeed, it is always my intention to give such officials the benefit of the doubt, however, in order to ensure my conduct and interaction on this site is optimal, I seek to to clarify the exact nature of the creative collaboration between myself, and those who provide and maintain this platform.

Apology/Disclaimer

These are questions which, to the best of my ability, I was unable to answer for myself by looking through the Guide and FAQ, it is suggested by that guide to consult the forums before emailing (for non members). I hope this is the appropriate sub-forum for such an inquiry, if it's not, I sincerely apologize, and hope this will be moved to the correct area. To the best of my ability I did check to make sure it was, I was unable to find any rules forbidding it, this topic seems to loosely fit sub-forums descriptions, and I saw a lot of similar topics (questions about the website and its functioning) active at around the same time, even so, if it was incorrect for me to post here, I deeply apologize.

Formal Introduction to the Community.
On a somewhat unrelated note, it occurs to me that this is my first contact of any kind with the wider community of CHYOA. I look forward to sharing this space with you all, and will take this moment to introduce myself. I came to this website over a year ago, I have spent a lot of time as a ghost, and have enjoyed many of the stories here. About six months ago, I started an account to write the first rough draft to my current story, Sex Trek, after this initial, tentative experimentation with the sites creator tools, I have decided to look into committing more fully to making content for the site, the list of questions in this thread is part of my attempt to become acclimated.

If this place can become a permanent home for my writing, I hope to make extensive usage of the variables and conditionals, as well as, hopefully, recruiting people who share my vision to help write my content. So to anyone who's interested in collaborating, feel free to message me.

It is my hope to write the kind of high quality interactive erotica for this website which I would most enjoy myself, indeed, it is my belief that this is the most any artist, amateur or professional can do, write for their own enjoyment and hope that others share in it. I don't know if this community is the right place for my writing, but, I approach it with respect for the fact that it is not mine, I come here as a guest. If I can bend to the restrictions of this place, I will, if not, I will leave, without protest.

I have and will have other questions of course, but for now, I'll see how my first line of questioning is received. Also, I think I should point out, that my writing and conversational style isn't this dry, but the nature of this post calls for a certain amount of formality.

Edit: Minor Grammatical/Spelling corrections.

 

1) Yes, you can delete any chapter on a story you own, however, any chapter past it must also be deleted (for example, if it is Chapter 3 and someone has added six more chapters, those chapters will also have to go). I'd also say that deleting someone else chapter that you have approved will most likely not go well with the community in general.

2) Yes, you can edit any chapter on a story that you have owner/editor privileges on, however, I'd consider it poor manners to not inform writers what you intend to edit.

3 & 4) Unless you delete your account, you will always be an owner of any story you create. Other's may be added as an owner if you are inactive for a very long time (about a year)

5 & 6) I'm not certain of any legalities (hopefully a mod can chime in), but the only reason I can see for an admin to remove your story/delete it is if you were to break rules. I'm assuming any moderator who was caught stealing/trying to sell someone elses work would swiftly lose that position.

 

Technically, you are able to delete any chapter of your story, no matter who wrote it. (You might have to delete the child chapters first.)

So the question is rather: Why would you change your mind?

And what would the contributor think if you delete their chapter after approving it? After all, the author (usually) has put some effort into the chapter.

My recommendation on that point:

- Use your Writer Guidelines to make clear what you expect from your contributors.
- Try to make the chapter fit during the approval process.
- If something changes so radically that you feel the neccessity to delete the chapter... get in touch with the author first. Most things can be handled. Maybe he rewrites a part of it or you edit it to fit the new situation. (If you edit a chapter, be sure that the author doesn't edit it at the same time.)
- Never just delete content. If it is unavoidable, allow the author to keep a copy of the chapter. If it doesn't fit your story (anymore,) they might want to reuse the content for another story.​

Side note about approving chapters: You should approve/decline a contribution within 10 days after the author published it. Declined chapters will be set back to draft mode and the decline reason will be shown on top of the chapter. Declining doesn't delete content.

Yes. The story owner, all editors (you can assign them by editing your story), and moderators can edit all chapters of your story. (Editors can't access the Edit Story page.)

If you edit a chapter, be sure that no other user edits it at the same time as it might lead to a content loss.
E.g. User A opens the chapter and makes changes. User B opens the chapter and makes changes. User A saves the chapter. User B saves the chapter. -> the changes from User A are irreversible lost!

If you are inactive for about 6 months, other users can adopt your story and usually become an editor.
You will still be the owner of your story.
The adopter should run the story the way the story owner would. (Though this isn't yet stated anywhere.)

If you assigned an editor by yourself and they are still active, the story isn't eligible for adoption.


If someone adds to your story, you should approve it within 10 days after publishing. The author put time and effort into their work and don't deserve to wait forever before their content gets reviewed.
After the 10 days, a moderator could publish the chapter, though they would only check if the chapter meets the site rules.
Currently, you might have more time for review as there is still a big backlog of unapproved chapters.
In general, I'm not yet sure when a moderator should review a chapter. I think I would prefer an automatic message after 10 days with a deadline of another 10 or so days before a moderator reviews the chapter.

I can't imagine any reason other than severe rule violations, though that might rather lead to pushing your story back into draft mode.

You have the copyright for your own chapters. You are also legally responsible for the content you publish.
You don't have the copyright for chapters which other users added to your story.

Technically, it would be possible to revoke the ownership, of course.
I'm not a lawyer, but I think that this would qualify as plagiarism as you created the content.

Practically, anyone could copy published content and sell it, though you might be able to take legal action against them.
Currently, you have full control over the content.


If you have any further questions, feel free to ask

 

"The only true wisdom is in knowing you know nothing." - Jon Snow

I'd just like to say I am both pleased and pleasantly surprised to get such great answers, from both you, in truth, I didn't expect anyone to read the post. Further, most of the answers to the questions were what I'd hoped for. Thanks to your responses, I doubt I'll have much trouble writing here, and as an added bonus, it seems relatively easy to work with contributors, as long as appropriate expectations are set beforehand. Based on your answers, it also seems unlikely I could completely lose control over a story if I'm even semi-active.

I'll be responding to the generous answers I've been afforded for the majority of this post, followed by any additional questions and statements I may have.

Responses

1) Of course you are correct, it would generally be rude to delete a chapter I'd already approved (especially without warning), and not something I'd normally do. However, there is a major difference between not deleting content from contributors, and not being able to. I can think of only a few rare situations where I might be compelled to do such a thing, but I just wanted to ensure that I do ultimately have the panic button if such a scenario were to occur.

2) Once again, your etiquette is to be applauded, of course it would be, especially assuming I'd already looked over things before approving.

3 & 4) Are you certain others can be added as owner, or simply as editor? This is a little different from gene.sis's answer, if your answer is correct (or both happen to be correct), then is there anything I can do to retain ownership? Such as for example, changing my story to private during a planned hiatus, or informing the site officials of such a planned absence? Ideally for such an absence, I'd assign a trusted editor beforehand, but still. A year is quite a bit of leeway in any event, this is a problem I'm unlikely to have, still, ideally I should remain informed on the conditions under which I might lose ownership.

5 & 6) These seem like fair assumptions to me, and gene.sis's post seems to have clarified the issue further. I definitely intend to avoid breaking any rules (in any event, they seem pretty easy to follow so far). Moreover, I'm pleased to hear that a general attitude of fairness seems to prevail among the backers here, if you're any example. I'll admit, one reason for this post was to test the waters, to see if the community was generally reasonable, you've assured me of that in spades.

Thank you for being so patient with my lengthy post, I'll be sure to check out your work, not as quid quo pro, but because you seem like an interesting person.

1) A succinct answer, and excellent advice as well. I will be using your recommendation on this matter as a reference point when going over potential contributions.

2) Good to know, the extra information you provide is much appreciated, something to bear in mind when editing. As in my response to gene.sis, I would at least try to give the author the chance to edit first, the point you make emphasizes the benefits of keeping a protocol for doing these kinds of things.

3) This answer taken alone seems to indicate that I can never totally lose control over a story, unless I lose my account or transfer ownership (if that's possible). However, Ben Rosewood stated that I could lose ownership after about a year of inactivity, is this true in addition to your answer, or is there an inaccuracy here? Your point about the 10 days is very useful. I agree with you about the message after 10 days, even though I'm unlikely to take longer than that myself. Of course, as a new user, I don't think it's appropriate for me to make suggestions about improvements to the site myself. However, if you were to make a poll or thread of some sort advocating for such an improvement, I would certainly vote in favor.

4) This is very good to know, the site rules grant me more leeway than I expected.

5) Good to know that I not only retain the copy right, but also to hear some of the rational behind that.

Thank you very much for your excellent responses, your answers have gone above and beyond what was requested, the extra information you provided is invaluable to me.

Questions and Closing Statements.

While I am glad to have gotten answers after consulting the forums, I feel compelled to ask, where is this information listed? Are these unwritten rules? After searching thoroughly, I was unable to find anything as specific as "A Moderator can publish a chapter pending review after 10 days". To be clear, I do take your word for it, your profiles indicate a certain amount of experience on the site. That said, if there is further documentation regarding the topics discussed, I would very much appreciate if anyone could provide references.

Other than that, my curiosity is sated, I could ask more about various things, but for now I'll relegate them to until I've made more progress with my story. After all, my current work isn't popular enough to have contributors in the first place, so this topic could have been considered putting the cart before the horse anyway, but I would've hated for a contributor to show up out of the blue some time from now and not have a clue about the protocol.

For anyone who's interested, updates will be quite regular, and I won't take much time getting back to potential contributors.

Edit: Minor grammatical and spelling corrections.

 

I'd recommend you defer to gene.sis's answers as he's an actual moderator.

 

Noted.

 

If someone adopts a story, they can get assigned story role "Owner" or "Editor."
Usually, they become editor. Role owner is only necessary if they want to add a story picture.
If someone gets assigned the story role "Owner," you will still be the owner of the story. (I think an added owner can't delete the original owner, though I'm not exactly sure about that. They definitely shouldn't do that and if that would happen, you could contact Friedman (site administrator) to fix the story roles. On earlier versions of CHYOA, the owner was replaced by the adopter as it wasn't possible otherwise and if the user comes back now, they can get the ownership back. )

I guess all these things would work.

Yes. I think the only irreversible way of losing ownership is when you ask for the deletion of your account.

About six months. If a story isn't abandoned that long, moderators might review added chapters. Contributing users also might get assigned the "Author" role.
(Though you won't lose ownership and your story gets an additional editor/owner)

It doesn't matter if you're new or a veteran
You can suggest new features in the Suggestions subforum or vote for existing suggestions by liking the initial post of the suggestion.

Currently, I try to inform the users manually after about 10 days. So the automatic message part would be to make it easier for me ^^

Well, that's basically how it is done.

Currently, it is stated in the Unapproved Chapters list which is only accessible for moderators. (So you won't find that.)

If I create a manual/page for the CHYOA Guide, I try to make it easy to understand without omitting any information. Not being a native speaker doesn't make it easier for me, so writing them takes some time. As there are also other things to do, I rather delay writing manuals except I'm in the right mood for them. (But I'm already taking mental notes for that.)

Well... I think it's not quite predictable how contributors pick stories to add to.
From my own experience, I would say the reason is "Everything fits..."

 

With this post, the originally intended topic has been explored to the OP's (meaning my own) satisfaction, I thank gene.sis and Ben Rosewood for their excellent responses, and the many others who have and may spectate this thread in the future. It occurs to me as I'm writing this, that this thread itself may be the only existing record for the answers to some of the questions which have been brought up. I am therefore honored to take what little credit there is in being the one to posit such inquiries, though in truth, this thread is a testament to the community, for anyone can ask questions such as this, but they typically fall on deaf ears. In all honestly, I was half expecting to receive insults, or be banned for the audacity of posting this thread. Of course, I will continue to respond to any replies I get here, and I would encourage people to add to the discussion here if they see fit.

I hope that this will be the beginning of a fruitful relationship between myself and the CHYOA community.

Following will be some replies, additional questions and statements.

Replies

1) That's very useful, I'm glad that could be clarified, it seems the system affords the original owner every reasonable opportunity to retain control.

2) This is especially true if these are valid methods of reserving control, it appears the only way to even temporarily lose control, is to ghost one's own story completely. As such, what few lingering concerns I might have had on the matter are gone.

3) Interesting, I'll have to remember to never specifically request the permanent deletion of my account.

4) I am curious, if an owner is added to my story, can I have the owner removed if I return? At this point, such a scenario even occurring seems very unlikely, but I ask since we're on the topic anyway.

5) Very generous and courteous of you of course, I'll bear it in mind.

6) Oh, of course, but I can see how such an automated system could reduce the workload on a site like this. Which would of course, free up time for more productive activities, such as writing manuals on obscure lines of inquiry.

7 & 8) As hinted at in my previous jest, that's completely understandable, the rules of this site are not so formal, but I can tell they are consistent, which is what matters.

9) Yes of course you're right, it's not that easy to predict, which is why I thought I'd make this thread.

I am glad to find out you are a moderator, this grants a reliability to the answers here that I could only fantasize about previously. Additionally, I am glad you are a moderator, because it assures of me of the quality of the site officials.

Sincerely, thank you, you can rest assured that you have made this website a superior experience for me through your responses. I hope to repay your efforts by providing a wealth of content for the users here.

 

I think so. (I haven't tried it but if it doesn't work, you could still ask Friedman to do that. You could also create a story in draft mode and play around with it.)

Though if I would be in that situation and the adopting user did a good job, I would consider keeping them as a co-owner or at least change their role to Editor.

You're welcome

 

Actually, that raises a question for me as well. Apologies for the necro, if this is considered as such. But I thought that posting here would be better than making a whole new thread, and my question is actually inspired by and related to the ones have been asked above.

So, it's possible for someone to adopt your story after a certain point, that much I understand and accept. However, how does this apply after a story is done? i.e. let's say I write something, I finish it, and I am happy with it. Then, I wander away for a little bit, say a year or so. Will I return to find that someone has adopted a story that I meant to end there, and what recourse would I have in that situation?

 

Not at all.

Well, CHYOA stories are usually never finished as there will most likely be options which haven't been written yet.

If someone adopts a story, they should continue it as the original author has envisioned it.

If the story is set to "private," it implies that contributions aren't welcome or only contributions from certain authors.

If a story gets adopted, the original author will still be able to manage the story after they return.

 

Thanks for getting back to me, and sorry for not replying sooner! I had other things on my mind, and this sort of slipped out of it. Anyway, in regards to your answers, much thanks, I do have some more questions though, based n what you said.

For example, you said that CHYOA stories are usually never finished, and that's fair enough. But I do intend to finish my own - though it is of course possible that I won't. So for example, let's say that I do finish everything that I want to do with it. There are four main routes, each with multiple subchoices, each coming to its own separate ending. The story is therefore done, and there is nothing more that I feel needs added. The tale that I set out to tell is finished to my satisfaction, all variants of it have been done.

At that point, if enough time passes and someone else decides to adopt it and start adding to it, not only is that against my wishes, but it is actually harming my vision of what the story should be. I told that story, it was done. I do not wish new additions to it, no matter how high quality they may be. Not because I am being a snob, but because I had specific themes and a focus I was writing towards, and new submissions are probably not going to get that. So, from my point of view, the story is actually being lessened. It was...well, not perfect, since there is no such things, but it hit the beats I wanted it to, and addressed the issues I set out to address. That focus is as much part of it as the grammar and the concept.

Under this logic, would someone still be able to adopt it, even if that was expressively against the wishes of the original author?

I guess what I am asking is, what are my rights as the original author and owner of the story as opposed to someone else who wants to adopt it? Am I able to say ''No, it is done. I appreciate the eagerness, but I don't think it needs anything else.'' And in my absence, will that wish be respected so long as I make it clear enough beforehand?

 

I don't think there was ever a similar case.

If you don't want additions, you can do that by setting the story to "private."
(I'm not sure if @Friedman does allow adoptions of private stories at the moment.)

Even if someone would be allowed to adopt the story, they should continue it as the original author has envisioned it.
If you envisioned that the story must not have further additions, adopters shouldn't add to it. (You might add some lines about it in your story/writer guidelines. In a private story, the writer guidelines are only visible if you edit the story and to add an editor, you would have to open that page.)

 

If you don't want your story to be adopted by someone else, just let me know. We won't put it up for adoption then.

The owner has full control over the story and can dictate what happens to it.

 

Okay, much thanks! Sorry if this is being a bit of a pain, but I wanted to fully understand the rules in regards to adoption of stories since I am the sort who sometimes tends to wander away from sites for a long amount of time if I am not currently working on something there, so it's not impossible I may do so after I finish my current story. I wanted to be aware of what situations might crop up, and what I could do to help mitigate that potential, since I have a rather specific vision for the story at this point in time.

Again, thanks! Sorry to be so specific about this, I know it can be kind of a pain to answer questions like this, but I wanted to be sure I had a firm grounding of how things worked here so that I didn't mess up later. Better to ask now before anything is done then have to ask someone to fix it later, you know?

 

How do I change the mode of a story from moderated to private?

 

Is there anyway for me to delete a story I own without having to delete all the chapters I did not write?

 

Go to 'My Stories' > Find the story you want to edit and click the three dots on the right side > 'Edit Story'. From there you can change your story's mode.

No, although I suppose you could save those chapters into a word document.

 

I see no dots to the right side. Yes, I am logged in.

Link to image: https://imgur.com/a/VUlANWI

 

Strange... Anyway, alternatively, you can go to the introduction of your story and type '/edit' at the end of the address