Regarding site wide degeneracy

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Pattareth

Virgin
Anyone else notice a huge change in demographic and story content over the past few years. There was once a time on here not too long ago when you'd get decision fatigue over the amount of cool but sexually tame stories on this site, and if you wanted your story to get popular and do well, it couldn't stray too far from vanilla otherwise the majority of folks wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole. But around 2022-2023 it was like all the authors writing that stuff gradually dropped off the face of the earth, and then suddenly a whole bunch of new really extreme stories got really popular really fast all at once. And now we're at a point where it feels like a story cannot do well on this site if the MC isn't a pathetic gross manipulative loser with a fetish for bimbofication/cuckholding/diapers/forced gender transition (obviously not all are like that but you get the idea). It feels like if stories like Funatic's "The Gamer" or Fantasy's "Affection Multiplier" released today (regardless of genre oversaturation), they'd never so much as get story of the week, let alone become the most popular and highest rated stories on the whole site. I rarely read anything on this site anymore because nearly everything new that gets written ends up getting to a chapter that invokes a feeling of visceral anger or abhorrent disgust in me. Am I the only old site user whose noticed this or feels this way, or am I just the only one from back then whose stuck around for this long on a site where I no longer feel like I belong?
 
I don't read the majority of stories on this site because they don't appeal to me.
I've written many chapters that get no likes, and the ones without sex/degeneracy are far more likely to not get likes.
Sometimes you just write for you and not for likes.
If there is a story you enjoy, make sure you give likes and positive feedback.
 
It's not just you, I've noticed it too.

For me, I first noticed it when we had the issues with Patreon. I tend to write in the family category, and my numbers dropped off a cliff when it was withdrawn. I know it's back now, but I get less than a quarter of the numbers I used to get on my stories. Not sure how or even if it's connected, but I felt like the stories that interested me as a reader slowly disappeared around that time too (I don't just read family, I read all sorts).

There is just so much of the same stuff being regurgitated. The vast majority of it revolves around manipulation of some type. I miss the porn with a plot stories set in the real world with real characters doing real things (well, fictional, but based in some sort of reality).

Sad to say, but with a lack of interest in what I'm writing, and a lack of interesting stories for me to read, I am slowly withdrawing from my beloved CHYOA. AO3 is my go to right now.
 
...I mean, I'm one of those degenerates, and weirdly one of my most popular stories right now is so vanilla there's been nothing beyond oral sex yet.

I think the site changes have shifted the dynamic a bit, and stories tend to come in waves, where something popular at the moment leads to a number of variants as people riff on their own versions. The churn is real. I don't have the numbers to back up the shift, however.
 
Dansak said:
It's not just you, I've noticed it too.

For me, I first noticed it when we had the issues with Patreon. I tend to write in the family category, and my numbers dropped off a cliff when it was withdrawn. I know it's back now, but I get less than a quarter of the numbers I used to get on my stories. Not sure how or even if it's connected, but I felt like the stories that interested me as a reader slowly disappeared around that time too (I don't just read family, I read all sorts).

There is just so much of the same stuff being regurgitated. The vast majority of it revolves around manipulation of some type. I miss the porn with a plot stories set in the real world with real characters doing real things (well, fictional, but based in some sort of reality).

Sad to say, but with a lack of interest in what I'm writing, and a lack of interesting stories for me to read, I am slowly withdrawing from my beloved CHYOA. AO3 is my go to right now.
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I got on AO3 for the first time in a while today because of this comment and found a story that I'm looking forward to checking out later, so thanks a bunch! I tried using AO3 several times in the past but I find it really difficult to search for specific genres of story on there where they don't have categories or tag exclusion (that I'm aware of). Authors like to cram as many tags onto their stories as possible on that site, so you end up seeing a whole lot of everything no matter what tag you type in. Also I just don't read fanfics for IP's that I'm not a fan of or have not seen/read, which limits what I might find enjoyable to only like 10% of stories on that site.

Can you recommend some good slowburn/vanilla/family stories on there? Like AO3's equivalent to Threenips "Living in your sisters shadow" or Lew54321's "Kink Development Kit"? My preferences for incest stuff is that it has to be the POV of a straight guy, can't be grandparents, and can't be father daughter/uncle niece. So basically just a young guy chasing his young looking mom/aunt, sister(s), or female cousin(s), like in the aforementioned stories.
 
Zeebop said:
...I mean, I'm one of those degenerates, and weirdly one of my most popular stories right now is so vanilla there's been nothing beyond oral sex yet.

I think the site changes have shifted the dynamic a bit, and stories tend to come in waves, where something popular at the moment leads to a number of variants as people riff on their own versions. The churn is real. I don't have the numbers to back up the shift, however.
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Do you intend to keep that story going in a mostly vanilla direction to the very end? If so then you have my interest, and I'd very much like to know which one of your stories you're referring to lol. I remember you recommending me Louis Lanes Night Out on a forum post a few years ago and I shot it down cause I've barely read/watched anything DC, and I knew I'd be really lost for context for some parts.
 
Pattareth said:
I got on AO3 for the first time in a while today because of this comment and found a story that I'm looking forward to checking out later, so thanks a bunch! I tried using AO3 several times in the past but I find it really difficult to search for specific genres of story on there where they don't have categories or tag exclusion (that I'm aware of). Authors like to cram as many tags onto their stories as possible on that site, so you end up seeing a whole lot of everything no matter what tag you type in. Also I just don't read fanfics for IP's that I'm not a fan of or have not seen/read, which limits what I might find enjoyable to only like 10% of stories on that site.

Can you recommend some good slowburn/vanilla/family stories on there? Like AO3's equivalent to Threenips "Living in your sisters shadow" or Lew54321's "Kink Development Kit"? My preferences for incest stuff is that it has to be the POV of a straight guy, can't be grandparents, and can't be father daughter/uncle niece. So basically just a young guy chasing his young looking mom/aunt, sister(s), or female cousin(s), like in the aforementioned stories.
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AO3 (like most sites) is far from perfect. I much prefer CHYOA as a platform, it's more user friendly and the readers here are unbelievably nice. I think AO3s system that relies heavily on tags sucks IMO. It is a huge site though and that (again, IMO) actually goes against it, it's tough to find the diamonds in the rough. Having said that, with original work being in such a minority there it makes it more manageable if you're not after a fanfic. IT's still big though, the other day I did a search and even with me being heavy on the filter requirements it still came back with over a thousand options. The other major issue with AO3 is it's lack of rules on content, although the filters are good enough to weed out the worst of it, but some horrible stuff occasionally slips through the net.

I'm a big fan of Three Nips to so I know the kind of story you're looking for. I can't think of any on there right now, but if I do I'll let you know.
 
What are some examples of extreme and "degenerate" (bearing in mind we are on a porn site) new stories that are getting all of the likes? Because I am not seeing them personally. I would feel very confident that if The Gamer or Affection Multiplier came out now they would still be hugely popular.
 
I've been a lurker for a while, not long ago made an account so I'm not familiar with how this site specifically was but as I have been around similar sites and forums, change of trends are common and authors sudden inactivity is a natural thing that happens on every site.

Also wouldn't dismiss it as a phase as things might evolve further (don't know to which point), I suppose community projects/challenges could be arranged to sway a bit from the "degenerate" content.
 
If I may so bold as to sing my own praises... one of my stories, It's Good to Be the King, has a reasonably deep plot, varied characters, and enough sex to keep it interesting but most of the chapters are plot-driven rather than cock-driven. The sex itself is what most would consider vanilla; there's nothing more exotic than a bit of FFFM group action in one thread. My additions to the story have slowed but I still plan to expand on it (there are no outside contributors, it's all me). It also has two actual endings, and one thread is almost there. 243 total chapters, longest thread is 69 chapters long (that's just a coincidence).

And it has illustrations, but don't let that worry you; the story would still work perfectly well without them The pictures are there to supplement the writing, not replace it.
 
So no examples then.

If I'm honest, what I am getting from this post is that there has been a decline in popularity in incest stories over the past few years. That can happen with a shifting demographic, and I can understand the frustration if that is your bag.

That said, I would be careful about effectively calling everyone who uses the site currently degenerates (I say this as a new user). Especially when you can't back up your claims. Keep in mind a lot of people would not consider incest "vanilla" and would nope right out of any story that features it. Kink shame not, lest ye be kink shamed and all that.
 
Tommyshelby said:
So no examples then.

If I'm honest, what I am getting from this post is that there has been a decline in popularity in incest stories over the past few years. That can happen with a shifting demographic, and I can understand the frustration if that is your bag.

That said, I would be careful about effectively calling everyone who uses the site currently degenerates (I say this as a new user). Especially when you can't back up your claims. Keep in mind a lot of people would not consider incest "vanilla" and would nope right out of any story that features it. Kink shame not, lest ye be kink shamed and all that.
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Dawg, I didn't answer you cause you came off as hostile and it was clear that no matter what I said you're only objective was to refute me and you would have twisted my words in any way you needed to in order to achieve that.

I did not claim that incest was vanilla. Incest was first mentioned by someone else, not me, and they also did not claim that incest was vanilla. I replied to them cause incest is one of the few taboo tags I enjoy and even then it has to be a hyper specific variety of incest.

I did not call everyone who uses this site degenerates, nor was I implying that. My complaint is that there is an unavoidable all encompassing amount of degenerate content on this site now, and that this entire site seems built around targeting and attracting a degenerate demographic. I missed the days when that was not the case.

As for examples, literally just open the front page of the website dawg. It is littered with futa, free-use, gender bending, manipulation, and degradation content. I just scrolled through every latest chapter and couldn't even find ONE romance option. Chyoa is in a major vanilla drought.
 
Hostile? I just politely disagreed with you. As for me having a clear agenda to refute you and twist everything you might say, you were reading an awful lot more into that post than what was actually there.

Sorry there aren't more nice, romantic stories about dudes fucking their sisters or (young looking) mothers lol. My objection with you is the condescending and judgemental word that you have used and continue to use - 'degenerate' - which you seem to think applies to other people with different tastes to you but not you. So futa or gender bending is degenerate but people fucking immediate family isn't? Okay then. I also can't help but be amused that you describe kinks you don't like as degenerate and kinks you do as taboo.

If you want to complain about stories not being vanilla enough for you that is fine, but be careful who you insult. Especially when your own tastes don't seem to be that vanilla.
 
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I'm also sceptical of the claim that the site is becoming less vanilla and more "degenerate", but unless we get hard data of what the site looked like 5 years ago, and compare it to the situation today, that's never going to move beyond a gut feel.

Something we can do, at least, is look at the current situation. Here are the 10 stories published in the past 90 days that have the greatest chapter depth (117 to 31). Themes, in order:
  1. Accidentally a God: isekai fantasy, no fetishes mentioned in tags or chapter titles
  2. The Luck Runs Out: fantasy, lists all the fetishes, including m/f dom/sub, power play, enf, bodymod, genderbending, spanking, brainwashing
  3. Mana Farming in Anime Worlds: isekai, no tags, but seems vanilla
  4. New Family Life: incest, obviously, but mentions that the PC wants to "protect" the his family, so unlikely to feature extreme content
  5. Diamond Girl: superhero? No fetishes mentioned, but seems consensual judging from chapter titles
  6. Into the Game: sci-fi'ish genderbending and more
  7. Mommy Fucks a Bully: NTR, likely includes msub (as in "forced to watch") and fsub (as in "forced to undergo") content
  8. The Method: consensual BDSM
  9. Absolute Control: The Bald Telepath: "subtle hypnosis content"
  10. Desire, Revisited: straight "you're special and can do whatever you want" power fantasy, long list of fetishes including ws, exhib, spank, handholding, ENF, transformations, gloryhole

Doing the same by sorting by most viewed, and skipping stories that I already listed above:
  1. Wanna Bet?: people have to accept all bets. Some tags: mc, spank, FFM, cuck
  2. It's live: make streamers do what you want. No tags, but chapter titles suggest various fantasy transformations (ie. not gender)
  3. Vacation Fun: mind control power fantasy story, chapter titles additionally suggest mdom and humiliation
  4. Image Caption Story: various seemingly-unrelated stories, seems pretty vanilla
  5. Compound BM-b0: transformations, particularly women to bimbos and men to "raging bulls"
  6. Given Names: mdom mind control harem story. Tags list a bunch of fetishes, including extreme ones like ws.

So which of these count as "degenerate"? Well, that depends on your tolerance for such content, I guess. Mine is pretty high, but if I try to look at the list through a more mainstream vanilla lens, I'd say from the first list: 2, 6, 7, and 10; and from the second: 1, 2, 3, 5, and 6, for 9/16.

I was surprised 2 of the 16 recent popular/active stories feature watersports. That's hardly mainstream, even in porn/erotica, but it seems like it is less of a niche thing than I thought.

Less surprising to me is the number of straight-up power fantasy stories: 9 and 10 from the first list, and 1, 2, 3, and 6 from the second, or 6/16, which also accounts for the majority of the "degenerate" stories (5/9). These appear to be the stroke stories of the 2020s: congratulations, you are now omnipotent, go fuck everyone you meet. (I don't like them, if that wasn't obvious. :P)


And one final, more personal data point: I'm currently writing and publishing a pretty vanilla (but incestuous) storyline, after a 6 month break, and I'm getting about 40% more daily views now than before the break.


So my take-away is this: there is certainly plenty of "degenerate" content on the site... but vanilla stories are alive and well, and if that's what you want to write, there are plenty of people out there who will be happy to read it.
 
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This is by far the best site out there functionally for creating good erotica. But there's a disconnect in that we don't attract enough readers, and the really good authors (present company excluded of course :) choose to publish on sites like Literotica even though I know they would like and use the extra function offered here.

Just a quick list off the top of my head of why this site is superior: You can embed images, change chapters after you publish and notice a typo, do a linear story or branching (easy alternative endings), use variables, do markdown text, easily drive traffic (what little we have) with frequent new chapters, etc. Those are huge wins.

Yes, we've become overly fetishized it appears. You need tentacles or gender-swapping incest to get a large share of readers already here. The key detail is people already here.

So we can accept the way things are, which is totally fine by me, or think of new ways to attract those authors and readers.
 
And now we're at a point where it feels like a story cannot do well on this site if the MC isn't a pathetic gross manipulative loser with a fetish for bimbofication/cuckholding/diapers/forced gender transition (obviously not all are like that but you get the idea).

Non-consent has tags. I try to do that more so in my newer work than in my older stuff. Specifically calling out non-consent branches.

As for the stuff I'm not into that you mention diapers tends to be a genre that the writers advertise upfront imo. Cuckholding maybe not so much? But it's usually marked NRT I think when it comes up.

I grew up watching Charmed and fantasy shows where mind control plots, transformation, and other supernatural elements triggered a kink in me. That being said I think there is an issue where a lot of stories need to select a single genre when created. Whereas they might fall into different categories depending on which branch you take.

Honestly my bigger issue is that a lot of stories tend to be very linear with the writer only focusing on a single branch. I've dabbled with that type of writing a couple of times, but mainly in that I can get feedback from the comments on deciding where to go next. Or posting Google polls.
 
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