Pokemon and the Harkness test

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Defruron

Virgin
So I have a question and havnt found the answer in the forum. If I missed it, Im sorry.
Do Pokemon pass the Harkness test?
1. I would say they are intelligent. Some Pokemon are even far more intelligent than humans, but the others I would go on about the same intelligence.
2. They cant really talk to humans (maybe some which telepathy) but they can communicate among each other.
3. This gives me the most struggle, because technicaly the base state of a pokemon can breed in the games. Also there are episodes in the anime, where for example an old Treecko is shown (in the episode where Ash caches his Treecko), so the evolution state has nothing to do with age.
On the other hand, most base state Pokemon are quite small, so I dont know if its ok.
I hope someone can answer me this question.
 
I'd say no

Barring a few exceptions, most Pokemon are about as smart as animals and are depicted as such. Which make sense, the whole, capture and fighting is already ethically questionable enough. Adding in human like intelligence opens up a whole other can of Caterpies

I suppose you could get away with it, with the more humanoid ones like Mr. Mime(oh, dear god) but not in general.
 
Defruron said:
So I have a question and havnt found the answer in the forum. If I missed it, Im sorry.
Do Pokemon pass the Harkness test?
1. I would say they are intelligent. Some Pokemon are even far more intelligent than humans, but the others I would go on about the same intelligence.
2. They cant really talk to humans (maybe some which telepathy) but they can communicate among each other.
3. This gives me the most struggle, because technicaly the base state of a pokemon can breed in the games. Also there are episodes in the anime, where for example an old Treecko is shown (in the episode where Ash caches his Treecko), so the evolution state has nothing to do with age.
On the other hand, most base state Pokemon are quite small, so I dont know if its ok.
I hope someone can answer me this question.
Click to expand...
I think Pokemon toe the line, and it's quite easy to depict them as either passing or failing the Harkness test without significantly deviating from canon. That said, I'm inclined to agree with these points.
  1. Some Pokemon behave with animal intelligence, while others behave with human intelligence. This doesn't appear to correlate very strongly with the type of Pokemon - you could have a wild Pikachu with animalistic behaviour, or one that is simply well-trained, but you could also have a Pikachu that is more of an equal companion, as is the premise of the series.
  2. Pokemon can communicate with their native language (which consists of saying their name over and over again...) but importantly, trainers are repeatedly shown to be capable of understanding their Pokemon. I'm not sure how this is possible, but apparently, it is.
  3. It can be assumed that it is possible for a Pokemon to reach sexually mature age, so there's no reason you couldn't simply depict all of the Pokemon in your story as being adult for their species (in addition to satisfying rule 1).
 
Defruron said:
So I have a question and havnt found the answer in the forum. If I missed it, Im sorry.
Do Pokemon pass the Harkness test?
1. I would say they are intelligent. Some Pokemon are even far more intelligent than humans, but the others I would go on about the same intelligence.
2. They cant really talk to humans (maybe some which telepathy) but they can communicate among each other.
3. This gives me the most struggle, because technicaly the base state of a pokemon can breed in the games. Also there are episodes in the anime, where for example an old Treecko is shown (in the episode where Ash caches his Treecko), so the evolution state has nothing to do with age.
On the other hand, most base state Pokemon are quite small, so I dont know if its ok.
I hope someone can answer me this question.
Click to expand...

I'd say no.

First off, because technically they do not pass because they can't properly communicate.

In essence, Pokemons are the paragon of a fictional animal. They embody all those qualities a master sees in his pet, they are just as intelligent as that.

I think the reasoning behind something like the Harkness test is exactly that to forbid sex with creatures that overall feel like animals, either because they look like it or behave like it or are simply percieved like it.

Pokemons are so close to all those boundaries:

1)some of them look close enough to real world animal,
2)most of them behave like "smart" animal,
3)for all I know, they serve the function of animals in their reality.

You see, reading your post I remembered I thought about this sometime ago. Since I felt Pokemon wouldn't pass but all the same fancied the concept and deemed it having a good potential, I came up with this.

It never went anywere, but that was my adaptation to overcome possible problems.
 
So as I thought this is a grey area.
It would be really good if a Admin or Mod could say how they interpret the rules.

SeriousBrainDamage said:
First off, because technically they do not pass because they can't properly communicate.
Click to expand...
I may have a solution for this. Maybe the Pokemon can communicate with the Trainer via telepathy. So communication wouldnt be problem anymore.
It would also show that they are intelligent.
 
Defruron said:
It would be really good if a Admin or Mod could say how they interpret the rules.
Click to expand...
I'm actually a mod, though not the final word. I can say that rule 2 is not so strict that you couldn't write away any issues. There have been stories approved with literal animals that aren't considered bestiality because the character meets all three Harkness requirements.

Also, I forgot to mention this before, but size doesn't really have any bearing on rule 2. It might affect rule 1 and 3, however.
 
The meaning of this thread is, I wanted to be sure if I can write a story (or chapters) about Pokemon, so I wont get banned or something like that, because my other story would be too important for me.

So what I can understand is, its a grey area and a story would be ok if the MC can communicate with the Pokemon (and understand it sort of (does body language count)), the pokemon is described as mature (so i guess knowing about sex and stuff) and is shown as intelligent.

Please correct me if I understand it wrong.
 
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I'm not quite familiar with Pokemon but as far as I know, a lot of them won't pass the Harkness test canonically.

So if you want to use them, you have to adjust them.

If a modified Pokemon can use (think) complex language and you show this in the writing, they would meet that part of the Harkness test.

If the creature can think in a complex language, body language can be used to show their intelligence. This is quite difficult.

Defruron said:
Maybe the Pokemon can communicate with the Trainer via telepathy.
Click to expand...
It is important that they were able to use complex language even before they met a trainer.
If they get the ability to use complex language from another character, they are still considered an animal.
 
What about the human-like pokémon? Mostly those from fighting type (except monkeys) and some from other types like physic. I am not very familiar with the canon so I am not sure if those still could be considered animals like other pokemon.

Then we have from the anime series the two obvious exceptions that clearly should pass the Harkness test, Team Rocket's Meowth because he can talk with humans after all, and Mewtwo from the first movie, because he can communicate with humans with telepathy, up to the point that probably he is the one who perceives humans as mentally inferior beings, at least at the start of the movie.
 
Well... I had a similar conversation recently with a friend, mostly because we were laughing about a joke we saw about how many pokemon are lewded, but anyway... It definitely does seem to in our opinion depend on the pokemon. A lot of pokemon, especially the more humanoid ones generally seem to have human intelligence and are shown capable of communicating in at least some sense with their trainer, being able to clearly understand their owner and capable of non-verbally communicating their own intentions.

Either way though... If you really want to use Pokemon... There is a simple and easy alternative that pokemon itself has given the world of people who want to lewd pokemon... The existence of the Pokemon: Mystery Dungeon Canon. Basically every pokemon in P:MD can communicate in english and is at least human level in intelligence.
 
This is one of the reasons I prefer the Digimon instead. All of them talk and behave like humans, and some of the male and female ones even look like humans, or at least resemble humans, making eroticization far easier.
 
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